S2E25 - I Am Open to Epic Sex

In this introspective and candid episode, Lisa (The Poly Wife) shares a recent breakthrough in her relationships. She reflects on being in multiple asexual relationships despite her desire for a primal, sexually fulfilling connection. Through conversations with her husband, her doctor, and her close friends, Lisa uncovers a pattern of overthinking, rooted in past traumas and a focus on fulfilling others' needs over her own. Inspired by her journey, she declares her openness to “epic sex” and resolves to let go of expectations and focus on enjoying the moment. Jess (The Playful Domme) and Ella (The Virgin) support Lisa’s reflections, emphasizing the importance of self-awareness, breaking free from internalized shame, and embracing joy and spontaneity.

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🔥SHOW NOTES🔥

[00:00:00] – Welcome & Introduction: Jess, Lisa, and Ella introduce the episode and Lisa’s big revelation.

[00:02:00] – Lisa’s Reflection: Why she is in multiple relationships but not having the kind of sex she desires.

[00:08:00] – Overthinking vs. Being in the Body: How Lisa’s deep mental processing has kept her from fully surrendering to pleasure.

[00:15:00] – The Turning Point: Realizing that she has been looking for partners who love to talk but not necessarily ones with strong physical chemistry.

[00:22:00] – The Challenge of Finding a Primal Sexual Connection: Why chemistry matters just as much as deep conversations.

[00:30:00] – Breaking Free from Limiting Patterns: Learning to say YES to experiences without overanalyzing them.

[00:38:00] – Lisa’s First Step: Having spontaneous, no-pressure sex with an old lover just for fun.

[00:45:00] – Final Thoughts & Listener Challenge: The hosts encourage listeners to reflect on where they might be overthinking intimacy and adopt Lisa’s mantra: “I’m Open to Epic Sex.”

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🔥RESOURCES AND LINKS MENTIONED🔥

• The Playful Podcast Website – Exclusive after-hours content, workshops, and events: www.theplayfulpodcast.com

• The Wheel of Consent by Betty Martin – Understanding personal boundaries and pleasure dynamics.

• Come As You Are by Emily Nagoski – Exploring female desire and sexuality.

• Lisa’s Coaching on Intimacy & Relationship Dynamics – Helping individuals embrace pleasure and connection.

Transcript

Jess the Playful Domme: 0:12

Welcome to the playful Dom, the Poly Wife and the Virgin Podcast, where we share our most intimate stories, experiences, and details of our love lives, our intimacy lives, our play lives, and giving you the opportunity to gaze in and get a glimpse of what could be possible in your life as well. As we share our stories, our adventures, we weave in tips. tricks and techniques to help build your confidence, boost your courage and give you the opportunity to ask for what you want in your life. Welcome to the podcast. Oh, and just a couple of quick thoughts before we get started. One, we are just everyday people. We are not professionals, licensed therapists, anything like that. This is for edutainment purposes only. This is not medical advice or legal advice, financial advice, none of the like that. Listen at your own discretion. And this is for mature audiences. We're going into deep subjects and sharing deeply about intimacy and all the things about that. So just notice who you're around and let's go. Hello listeners and welcome to the latest episode of the playful Dom the poly wife and the virgin podcast where we share our intimate details of our lives of connections, relationships, growth, and all of the things to help support us both in our, uh, romantic lives and in our everyday lives and the sisterhood and connections that we have and the laughs along the way. So today we're here to talk with. Lisa who wants to share about a revelation that she's had of the relationship she's in and also Um, a, a teaser update about the tantra chair, what's going on, where is this thing in the world? And, uh, you know, and then also a little piece, depending on my, uh, connection, if it works well, um, a little piece about my own healing journey that I'm on with my own feminine things. So, but we'll kick it off with Lisa sharing about where she's at in her revelation.

Lisa the Poly Wife: 2:25

Okay. So this was, okay, so this is a product of. Probably months of noticing. And, um, I, what I realized is that I'm, well, I'm in a lot of polyamorous relationships. I am actually not having a lot of sex. And so I started asking myself, why was I in so many asexual relationships? So my husband and I are platonic. Uh, there's. Um, no sexual energy between us. There's plenty of compliments and loving and all of that, but we don't have a sexual sort of. energy happening between us. Um, my boyfriend and I, uh, sapio, uh, there's sexual energy, but not good sexual chemistry. So we, we don't, it doesn't work for us. Sex just doesn't, we've tried it a few times and it wasn't awesome, but we have a level of intimacy. Um, In the way we relate to each other, how we cuddle, how we sleep together. He's the only person I really sleep with on a regular basis. I literally sleep, we're bedmates. And then there's my girlfriend. I'm not bi. So that's an asexual relationship. And, um, but it's more than platonic, right? We kiss and we do non genital related, um, expressions of sexuality with each other, but not. To each other, not with each other. Anyway. Okay. Um, and then there's, uh, Orion. That is my boyfriend. And we, when we get together, we have sex, but I just don't see him very often. And so maybe once or twice a year. So for a woman who, and Chiron, I never see. So for a woman who has so many relationships, not having a lot of sex, I started and I've had a lot of difficulty finding a sexual partner since Lambo in May. Um, and so. I'm very, I've dated, I've had a couple of dates, I've had dates with men that have not Quite gotten to second, third date. Um, lots of conversations with different men and they're just not getting anywhere. I've been, I knew earlier this year in April, I think I sort of March, April, I discovered that what I really wanted in my life was a primal relationship. And then Lambo and I got together and it was really a very primal. That's the most primal I've had. A really, any sexual. Any sexual relation with anybody that was definitely the most primal, but he ended up being monogamous. So when he really fell in love with somebody else, he didn't want to be in two relationships and we stopped. Right. So, and since him, though, I've been looking for a primary, primarily sexual relationship. I keep not having it. So I started to ask my, so the noticing was, why am I in so many asexual relationships? And. Noticing why I'm so successful at relationships, but, and why I'm so successful at relationships, but not at the sex part of the relationships. And I'm a very emoting person, right? I'm open. I'm honest. I, you know, I don't hold anything back. What you see is what you get. Um, and I'm, I can, I'll talk about anything. I'm really forward about my thoughts and, and I vet carefully, but I've been vetting carefully all along. And so I had three conversations. One was with my, um, the woman who's, uh, she's my Chinese medicine, uh, doctor. And, uh, she and I, she's known me my entire polyamorous experience. And when it was hard, she was helping me through that. And, um, we were just chatting the other day, catching up on something else. And I said, she says, how are you doing? I said, well, I'm really curious now why I'm not having a lot of sex. And relationships. I'm in a lot of asexual relationships. And we chatted and she says, well, why spiritually do you think it's coming up? Because the truth is, is that every single one of those people that's in relationship with me is having sex with somebody else. So, it's my It's what it is. I'm bringing it forward somehow in our these relationships. They're able and happy to have sex with everybody else, but not with me. So she posed the question in a way that made me think a little bit bigger. And, um, I got feedback about, um, what did I call him Selby. I went on a date with him in June, we had talked for three weeks we he's married I was married I was super excited about starting something with him we wanted exactly the same things. And, um, He wasn't really looking at me very much at dinner. He kept putting his head down and I found that a little bit disconcerting and it got me into my headspace of, uh, you know, I had really puffy eyes that night that I couldn't get rid of. So I was like, okay, he doesn't like how I look and he doesn't know how to say it. And he just, he just kept looking away from me in a way that. made me believe that it was really not a lot of chemistry, but our, our chat, our talk was really good. And at the end of the date, we kissed quite passionately and really enjoyed the kiss. And then he said, we don't want the same things two days later and ghosted me. So I really, He didn't tell me why after saying over and over again, if it didn't work out, we could part as friends. And I thought, wow, what did, you know, it must be me. Right. And well, as it turns out, he is now dating my girlfriend. They've gone on two dates. So dating is a, you know, too big of a term, but he, she asked him what happened. And he said that I was talking about vacations on our first day, taking vacations together on our first date. And Um, that was really more than he was willing to, you know, he wanted to see if we were even going to be dating long term. We hadn't even gotten there. It was the first date after three weeks of, So I'm going to talk a little bit about that. Quite intimate talk. And I took, so I got that feedback. And then, um, when I got home from my class with my doctor, I. Um, turn to my husband and I said, so why do you think. I'm I'm really kind of wondering why it is that I'm, I I'm in so many asexual relationships. He says, well, cause you're not any fun. And I was like, Whoa. That was a stab.

Ella the Virgin: 9:25

Wow. Really?

Lisa the Poly Wife: 9:27

Yeah. Yeah. So now that is, he's not wrong, and it's something that he and I have been talking about. So while it feels like a stab because it is a stab, it's not something that we haven't been discussing. And what, and

Ella the Virgin: 9:44

what does he mean by, what does he mean by that, that you're not any,

Lisa the Poly Wife: 9:47

I'll tell you in a moment. I'll tell you.

Ella the Virgin: 9:49

Okay.

Lisa the Poly Wife: 9:50

All right. Discussing between the two of us is that one of the, we have, we are in a rhythm in which all we do is talk about the logistics of our lives. And this, that's how we've acted for decades, right? We've, it's all, we do not, we liked different things. Even when we got married, but you know, we were in love and new energy, new energy and all of that stuff. And I forced him to do things with me because I thought we were supposed to do everything together. But once I realized that that was, I didn't want to go to the bars and watch him play in a band. And I definitely didn't want to go to church and he didn't want to. Whatever it was that I was doing at the time. And so we did different things, but we never did any activities together. And so we never had any fun together. We never played together. We never went on vacation. Well, now we went on plenty of vacations, but it was always with family. It was always so that we could see family. And also because we were all sharing the expense of that vacation. So in, in, in the case of when we went to the St. Bart's, it was, my sister was paying for a house and we. There were extra beds and as long as we could get there, we go. So we never have, we don't have fun together. So we've been trying to figure out the things that we can do together. That would be fun. So, but we're going to take in that information. You're not fun. And, and then my girlfriend was saying, you know, it's a lot, you're not, you're looking for a guy. And what you're looking for is a unicorn because you want a guy who's willing to talk about the relationship and, you know, go deeper on a first date. And then I. That's I heard her differently than I've heard her before. And I'm still thinking, why am I, why am I in so many asexual relationships? Why am I so in so many asexual relationships? I talked about vacations with Selby because I wasn't asking to go on a vacation. I was asking about whether or not his wife had veto power. And because he doesn't have the language that I have. All he heard was me talking about, well, when we want to go on vacation together, are we. That's what he heard. Not, you know, I'm looking to see, I'm asking you, if your wife says no, is that, is that what happens? Or can we make our own plans? And so I was asking the question, but all of this came to me at four o'clock in the morning on Saturday. I'm always in my head. I'm, I'm in a, I'm always in my head. I'm always thinking. I'm always, you know, I'm, I'm always thinking.

Ella the Virgin: 12:25

Well, I think, I think we all are. Right. So I think that's, I think we all are. So. You're not alone.

Lisa the Poly Wife: 12:32

That's true. But I, my formative sexual years, I was raped twice. So I know that I may have gotten married to a guy I felt safe with. So that's one thing, and that's coming to me in this moment. But I, and then it was always about making sure that they were happy. Not necessarily me. So I didn't even know how to have fun in bed. Right? So the fun was how, how do I position myself mentally, emotionally, physically, to make, ensure that the person I'm with my partner is happy. So now I was, I had a long marriage. We had, you know, reasonably great sex. And, um, now we want to explore other things and I'm having conversations and I'm getting great relationships because the guys who can process relationships well like to talk. So I'm finding the guys who like to talk and aren't as chemistry, like, hot for me in the same primal way that I was with Lambo. And so what I realized is that I am, I am overthinking everything. I'm pretend, and, So I'm not in my body, even when I'm having sex. So my sex isn't that fun because I'm still in the headspace of pleasing or trying to figure out what it is that I like and not farting. I mean, it could be any number of things that I'm in my head about, and I'm just not letting go enough. I'm not in my own body. Even with the central body work, I was thinking about the body work I did with the men that I was intimate with versus the men that were, um, clients of mine. And I am so in my head about protecting myself that I'm not relaxed enough to really give them as much of a sensual massage as I've been giving The men that I'm intimate with, with whom I have a heart. So

Ella the Virgin: 14:39

interesting.

Lisa the Poly Wife: 14:40

I'm seeing all the ways in which I am staying in my head and not being in my body. And so now I'm making that transition. And so the other thing, so in the early, my early sexual life, it was protecting my body, but because of, I don't remember what I called him here. Um, Alan, he was the guy whose girlfriend have ended up dating who wouldn't let me date boyfriend. Right. Because she had veto power and because Amy and Orion have veto power over each other as well. Um, and I accept it because I got into that relationship understanding that that was okay. Yeah. Alan and Francis, it wasn't okay. And I was a victim of it. So now anytime I'm talking to somebody with a significant other, I've got to make sure that I'm protecting myself. So I'm over asking on the first date and trying to get all the parameters. playground is now part of that is part of what it is that all of us have been talking about. For the last year and the fact that we want to lay out the boundaries and we want to lay out the playground, but I'm doing it on the first date. And I think I'm overthinking it. Right. So

Ella the Virgin: 16:00

yeah, yeah, a little, yeah, exactly.

Lisa the Poly Wife: 16:02

I'm trying to make the boundaries for the relationship before we even have a sexual encounter. And I think part of that is because I haven't healed all of the emotional wounds. Of the vetoes and the bad relationships that I've experienced over the last four years that we have time. So, yeah, so, um, so it's, what's interesting is I had the revelation Saturday at 4 AM and Monday at 5 PM. I was getting laid. I was actually getting, I had sex with an old lover of mine, um, that. It's telling me freaking every week I'm masturbating to your pictures. I really can't wait to have your mouth on my cock. He's constantly talking about having sex with me. And I keep trying to remind him that I'm really only interested in the relationship. And this revelation loose, loosened me to say, he's actually wanting to have sex with you. Why don't you just go and have sex? I have all the talking stuff. I don't have to force him into a relationship. He's shitty at relationships. Absolutely. Right. I watched him. And he did me in relationship, but he's always fantasizing about me. So I decided to go. And, uh, this is a guy, I think even I went out once or twice. Speed skater. Remember speed? Oh, no, I don't know. Yeah. Well, I don't think we know him. I don't know him. When Jess was living with me, he made data after date, after date, after date, and kept canceling on me. Actually, he canceled on me on labor day when you were living with me. Yeah, he canceled on me anyway. So I'm like, you know, why not just go for it and do it. And so I went and it was really pretty, not awesome and no satisfaction. I was so happy to not judge it. Just do it. Just be it. And say yes to something without over talking it. And I wouldn't let him talk to me because our habit is to talk about all of his relationships and his work and all of the shit. Fucking therapy session with him. And then we finally get down to business. I'm like, I'm not wasting my time. This time I am here for sex. And that is what we are going to do. So I got right. Oh, Lisa, I love you and shocked him. And yes, and we had a good, and we had a great time. Right. It was not good sex, but I had a good time and I came out of it saying, yeah, I really I'm now I can totally let go of him because if he calls and I'm in the mood, I'll just go for it. But I, I don't have to be in a relationship. I don't have to talk to him. I don't have to, I don't have to anything with him except respond if I'm interested when he calls and next time, tell him exactly what he needs to do to satisfy me before we get into anything.

Ella the Virgin: 19:09

Started.

Lisa the Poly Wife: 19:10

Yeah.

Jess the Playful Domme: 19:11

I have, um,

Lisa the Poly Wife: 19:12

I found that

Jess the Playful Domme: 19:13

a couple of, I have a couple of reflections actually. I don't know if it would be supportive for you. Um, but the, the one about the veto. So what I'm hearing about the overthinking too, is that like, that's really putting you in your masculine and on your feminine, the feminine. She's not in her head. She's in her body with how things feel. She's being really, choosing to be really present in the moment. And this is just from some things I've been learning for myself. The overthinking is a protection mechanism, could be a protection mechanism, and also a way to Um, yeah, I kind of, yeah, I would say protect the, the feminine in us. I have the same thing. We tend to go into my head a lot. Um, the veto thing, I'm curious if it's actually one of the very first questions out of the gate when someone's first showing interest in you, you know, because it sounds like that's another way that you're protecting your heart, you know, and to, and, Before there's all those three weeks of intimate conversations. You know, cause that's three weeks of your time that you've invested is, you know, at the beginning being like, Hey, you know, this is a, a new journey, you know, where I'm at right now, I've, I've experienced, uh, where I've been with partners who they're. Wives have, um, or primary partners have veto power and it's caused me some, you know, a lot of pain and, um, and I understand and I respect it. And I just want to know where you're at, um, because then, you know, that kind of, you know, when we go back to the conversation from our last podcast about like step one versus the 12th step. You know, going back to the first step of, of bringing up that thing, because there's nothing, there's nothing wrong with that at all about you, you know, yeah, I'm going to, if I'm open to investing in my heart and my body and my, my mind and sharing that with somebody else, and if this veto thing is something that's, You know, a buzzkill in whatever form of way that that looks or feels for you, then to be able to ask for that up front or in the first day of conversation, um, that way you, you, you know, and then you can work through it before three weeks later, and then you're on a date and there's a lot of misinterpretation of the thing. Um, and the thing about not having fun. What's fun for you, Lisa, is talking about relationships. What's fun for you is understanding the deeper nuances and the inner workings and those things. Like, those are the things that are fun for you. And they're fun for me too! And they're fun for, for Ella. Like, that's kind of why we're having this podcast and recording these episodes is to, to do that kind of deeper dive, um, information. And Uh, on our last podcast when we had Johnny on as, uh, as the guest, you know, afterwards he had very, um, effusive, positive things to say in particular about you, Lisa, and you know, that you're the way your mind works and how you see things in your perspective. So there's, you know, really beautiful things about that. Um, And I guess my last reflection point is if your desire is to have sex and have really good sex, you know, you have beautiful platonic, loving, caring relationships, and there's something about getting those needs met right now. Maybe there's someone who can be that bridge. Maybe they're not the, the one can, they can deep dive into the relationships and, and be in the head space of that. Maybe they are much more body oriented and that's, that's the, the partner for the moment and until there's something else. So just being open, open to understanding what your needs and desires are. Um, and I think what we do is fun. I get fascinated about this stuff and like Johnny and my friend, Johnny and I, we have really like hours long, days long conversations, dissecting and, and. Um, interpreting and examining and like, you know, and that, and I, I do that with other people too. I find it so fascinating. So, um, I think you're, I think you're super fun. Actually, I think you're a really, really fun person and I love spending time with you. You're on mute. So,

Lisa the Poly Wife: 24:02

and the, and the truth is, I am fun, and I came back to Ev. And said that I am fun and what, and all of these other people, everybody, everybody I have told is like, what's he talking about? You're not fun. Our relationship. Yeah. What I recognized and loud was that because I feel this is nothing to do with the truth. It has everything to do with how I feel. I feel that I'm carrying so much of an emotional burden for our relationship and a mental burden for our relationship that I don't feel comfortable relaxing enough. I'm afraid that he won't be able to pick up the pieces. Right. I, so. and we're talking about it, which is freaking fantastic. And I'm willing to say those things to him. It's like I realize that I don't have, um, my life, my, my, the having a roof over my head has nothing to do with SIO or Orion. So it's out of that con. But with the two of us, the business of our marriage overshadowed. Yeah. Fun that we have together. So he doesn't experience me as fun and he's a hundred percent right, but we have been Now we're more aware of it and we're talking about it, which is fantastic for us

Ella the Virgin: 25:39

And I think and I think lisa, I think there's a lot of couples that are that this is a very similar story You know if you've had any I mean, even after a year after the initial romance and, and, you know, great sex and the, and the energy of a new relationship, you start settling down into a business, right? I don't know how else to say it, a business relationship, a household relationship. Um, so, so sex and, you know, is, or whatever that, that type of fun is just not, I don't know, top of mind. Unfortunately, that's just what happens. But I think this is a great topic for our listeners because I believe there's a lot of couples.

Lisa the Poly Wife: 26:19

Who struggle with this and and the good news.

Ella the Virgin: 26:21

Yeah.

Lisa the Poly Wife: 26:22

Okay. So here my husband and I are and I am feeling let's pretend we're monogamous. I'm feeling the weight of our household, uh, ability to really dive deep into his emotions. Um, after 30, 35 years, he wants to have sex. But he doesn't want to do the emotional work that I want. Give in because he's my husband. And that's what I do. Or I don't give in and I don't have sex. And both of us settle into like, okay, well, this is what the rest of our lives are going to be like, because we have kids, which we don't, or we choose to stay together anyway, because it feels too complicated. I'm not missing. To fucking break up,

Ella the Virgin: 27:16

change everything. Yeah, that's right.

Lisa the Poly Wife: 27:18

I'm not missing enough to change everything, but here we are polyamorous and can struggle with being sexually intimate with my husband. I can struggle. He's not struggling being intimate with me. He's a willing partner. I can't get it up for him.

Ella the Virgin: 27:40

Yeah.

Lisa the Poly Wife: 27:41

I can't get out of my head. Right. So

Ella the Virgin: 27:43

yeah,

Lisa the Poly Wife: 27:44

this stuff is gonna break through everything. And, but I don't have to also feel guilty that he's not getting any, because he's got a girlfriend will see him. He wants to almost anytime. And he's got other friends who'd be willing to at a party just play. Right. So, um,

Ella the Virgin: 28:07

I love Jess's thoughts on this because, um, as a third party, because we've actually been speaking about this with a, another friend of ours. So, um, I hope, I wonder if she has good enough service right now, but I would love to hear her thoughts because this is real, this is real life and this is real stuff.

Lisa the Poly Wife: 28:23

It's real stuff. And, and I feel so okay and so happy about not having, feeling shame. About now. Yeah, sure. That's with him. And yeah, he feels relief that he doesn't have to buy me flowers every week. Because it's not, he doesn't, he doesn't want to, he'll do it for me if I ask him to. But then I'll have to remind him too. And then that,

Ella the Virgin: 28:53

yeah, yeah, yeah.

Lisa the Poly Wife: 28:54

The flowers isn't worth the getting, right? So,

Ella the Virgin: 28:57

yeah.

Lisa the Poly Wife: 28:58

But the last part of my aha moment was Molly, my girlfriend, chastising me. She's fucking sick of me feeling my not enough ness. Right. She's frustrated. She doesn't want to hear about it anymore. Um, she just literally doesn't get it. How could I possibly, why is my first thought always, oh, well, he can't look at me because I'm not enough. He can't look at me because he can't keep eye contact with people. I don't know that. But

Ella the Virgin: 29:31

yeah,

Lisa the Poly Wife: 29:32

she went out on a date with him. She goes, yeah, I noticed that he doesn't, he doesn't

Ella the Virgin: 29:36

just his thing,

Lisa the Poly Wife: 29:37

his thing. Right. But I took it personally because I have whatever guilt and shame or whatever about being polyamorous and I'm, you know, and I'm out. So it's this thing, but I thought, okay, well, I'm not pretty enough. That's why he didn't want to date me. And he's too, he's doesn't want to, doesn't know how to tell me that because It's a hard thing to say to a person that you've been telling, saying is gorgeous all along. Right. And so I dropped the shame and that not enough Ness on Saturday night too. Right.

Ella the Virgin: 30:13

Oh, beautiful. Yep.

Lisa the Poly Wife: 30:15

I have men masturbating to my pictures.

Ella the Virgin: 30:19

Yeah.

Lisa the Poly Wife: 30:20

Let's say week. I'm not going to say every day. I don't know who's doing it, but whether they're looking at my pictures on fat, whether they're looking at pictures I've sent to them, um, because we were in a relationship or not, I'm out there and I'm getting feedback from men that do this. So why do I feel I'm the one that's not attractive? Somebody's finding me attractive. This guy.

Ella the Virgin: 30:47

Of course. Yeah. You're a beautiful woman. Yeah, for sure.

Lisa the Poly Wife: 30:49

Right. So I, the, the not enough that that, that it's, I don't know if you've experienced this or not. The only way I can describe it is when I'm feeling all of these feelings, the not enoughness, what did I do wrong? I feel heavy when I get,

Ella the Virgin: 31:09

yeah, for sure.

Lisa the Poly Wife: 31:10

When I get the lesson that the heaviness completely disappears. Like I have no emotion around. Yeah. You feel light because it's just not true for me. Right. Yeah. Um, uh, yeah, so that all that's gone, I feel like totally lighter. I feel fantastic. And the details of how I got here are super blurry, except I had three conversations in one day that made me realize that. I'm I'm it's time for me to level up. Right. And

Ella the Virgin: 31:41

yeah, stop. Yeah, yeah.

Lisa the Poly Wife: 31:44

It was as first girlfriend and my boss in the same day told me they didn't like my energy. And I said, Oh, well it's you, but two of them who didn't know each other, who've never had contact from each other with each other, telling me exactly the same thing on the same day. I was like, so this was conversations in one day and. I was like, okay, I've got to have the change. So yeah, it was really, it was, it's, we'll see where we'll see how long it lasts and how I. Where I take it from here.

Ella the Virgin: 32:20

Yeah, that's beautiful. And again, I think there's a lot of points that we've touched on that again, every day we're all, we're all in our head to a certain extent. Um, we're all wondering if we're enough, we all end up in these relationships that, although we want them to be exciting and spicy and we want to be fun and all that, I mean, you know, it just becomes an area. I don't know how else to put it, you know, and it's, it's so, I mean, this is, this is real stuff. This is, this is real. conversation that we all have every day and it's, it's great to share it. Jess, do you have any feedback? I love, I love to hear your thoughts.

Lisa the Poly Wife: 32:56

Well, I had two thoughts. Um, so one just pin it to remind me about the guy at the dinner date. Um, the other thought that I, um, To your point about things being a business. I remember thinking about that back in like 2009 of like, what if people treated their relationships like a business, meaning you'd make deposits every day you do transactions, you know, like actually like treating it as. What, what, what am I investing into this company that I'm building this business? Um, because, you know, I look at how many of us strive and toil and put it in our 40, hours a week into a business to be successful at it, to, you know, really like, For the, for the, the money and, you know, whatever, all the reasons that we, we kick ass and, you know, throw in such a strong work ethic, but we don't apply that to our own relationships. We expect that the relationship is just going to, um, move on and steady as it goes with, without, with very little touch, um, in it. Uh, so in my mind, I was like,

Ella the Virgin: 34:05

Yeah, and that's a great point. I mean, why, I mean, maybe that's something we really need to work on and put something together is how, what, what kind of deposit did you make to your relationship today? You know, I think that's huge, turning it more of a positive spin and trying to get You know, not to get all that resentment built up because that's ultimately what happens, I think. And it just becomes like, Oh man, it becomes a drag. So great spin.

Jess the Playful Domme: 34:29

So to me, yeah, there's, you know, so there's transactional and relational business, right? So the transactional is, Oh, did you pick up the kids today? Oh, or like, or, you know, did you get the groceries? Oh, did you get the dry cleaning? Like that's, that's transactional business. Right. But then, and we know this. Especially those who are in sales of any kind, which by the way, everybody is in sales. Everyone is in sales. Cause we're all selling something. Um, and how do we do that? We do that through. Connect for me. How do I do it? I do it through connection. So, you know, I, I think that there's, because there's been, like you've mentioned, the resentment or not the, like, the in the, in touch, you know, not getting in touch with each other. Um, it, it reminds me actually of, uh, I, an impromptu kind of coaching session that I did with, uh, friends of Lisa's years ago, and. It was just like spur of the moment kind of thing. They shared things to each other that they haven't spoken of in years. Like they had huge, but it sounded like huge openings and breakthroughs in their communication. Um, and then there was just like a collapse afterwards of what happened because there wasn't a, A good structure to to to hold them through to the next place because I like this was like kind of like new for me at that time, but to see how how much had been pent up and held back in in particularly her communication because she was the one that wasn't. feeling the sexuality with her husband, she was the one that was in the know, she was the one that was turning him down, you know, and, and he's like, staying committed to being loyal to her, but But they're not in connection. Um, and they could get along really great on like the outside pages of the book, you know, like how they've run their life. It looks really like fantastic. They've, they've got it together. But when it came down to in their intimate relating with one another and their intimate connection, it was so, um, despair and remove. Um, and that takes, I think it would have taken several coaching or like actually kind of like an immersion experience with them. I think for several days to help them kind of get through all of the built up resentment piece, because this is the thing about us women too. I know Lisa's really good. So us women aren't good at expressing things. We aren't, We haven't been taught, trained. I mean, so much of our society has been about quelling and squelching our, no, um, you know, why did you do that thing or, you know, and not bringing things up. And, but, but we accumulate them. We, we store them. It's not like they just roll off our back. We, we keep tally about all these places that we said no. And then finally the resentment builds up where, you know, we're treating this thing. That's like, seems. So innocuous and like, like insignificant, and we treat it with a level of significance of like, you know, huge, huge thing. So, The business piece, um, to me is, and I, I think it starts, you know, kind of like how do you can connection points count and having the, started asking questions at the end of the day, like, what did you learn? What could you do differently? Or something like that. And like, that was building some more, um, connection. Cause there's, it's like how to, how to build the spark again, when you're just in a transactional relating experience. How to start touching into the connection again. Um, Lisa is, you know, and Lisa, because she and I have chosen to be polyamorous, you know, they have opportunities to have others outside of the relationship to fulfill those missing gaps. For the monogamous people, um, it's kind of like, how do you do a reset? Just as I'm saying it right now. Actually probably seeing a relationship coach or maybe a therapist too, if that resonates, but someone that can be the advocate to like helping reset the thing. Um, so it's not necessarily like, Oh, you know, her idea or his idea, but it can be the coach's idea of, you know, Hey, like, let's, let's try some practices that will deepen intimacy. So they have someone else to point and like roll their eyes at. You know what I mean? Like, Oh, I can't believe, or I can't believe we have to do this thing, you know, or, Oh my God, this is blah, blah, blah. You know, like they have someone else to grumble at instead of adding each other.

Ella the Virgin: 39:34

Yeah, I agree.

Jess the Playful Domme: 39:35

Um, so, so that's one of the thoughts and there's so many wonderful relationship coaches, intimacy coaches in the, um, for sure around just kind of You know, follow who you know you recommend or who resonates with you and and try the thing and and also find the the coach, I think, who advocates. For you to stay together, you know?

Ella the Virgin: 39:59

Yeah. Right.

Jess the Playful Domme: 40:00

Like if that's what you want, like find a coach that's advocating about that. Like, okay. You know, if whatever your, whatever your desire is, if even if it's like conscious uncoupling, like there are coaches that can support you in how do you dismantle with grace and kindness, um, a relationship that, um, isn't working anymore, but the, the pinning thought that I had about the dinner, Lisa is, Yes, you can own your peace about being so in your head about the veto thing. What comes up for me, on the flip side of that is the man had a real opportunity to step in and say like hey. You know, um, I'm hearing you talk a lot about the vacation and how it and what's coming up for me is that it's making me feel a little uncomfortable because this is our first date. He had the opportunity to do that. So in my mind, and And if he had said that you would have cleared it up immediately. Like, Oh my gosh, I'm just having this really hard time. Like how to say this veto thing, but like, that's really what it is. Like I'm, you know, I don't care if we go on vacations, I'm just saying like in the, you know, should something come up, you know, like you would have had an opportunity to clear it up. So what comes up for me is that he was looking for something to be able to be a no. So he was, maybe he wasn't able to say that on the calls. Maybe there were some things that were coming up for him that he wasn't able to verbalize and this is his easy out. So, and,

Lisa the Poly Wife: 41:28

and, and I'm don't resent at all that he didn't say anything. He wasn't the right guy for me for what all the reasons and any reason he wasn't the right guy for me. It was because he couldn't say something like that. And when I asked for clarification, he couldn't even text it to me, which feels. Yeah. So cowardly to me, but that's who he is. And if he's a guy who can't look me in the eye, which he is a guy that can't look me in the eye, I don't want to be in a relationship. So I'm, you know, I'm not going to say I dodged a bullet. He's a super nice guy and he's really, um, really loving. There was literally nothing wrong with him. accept his ability to communicate with me in a way that I need in order to move forward. So, um, if he asked me out again,

Jess the Playful Domme: 42:26

my question, so my, my question about that, and this can be my own hangup. So if it's my own projection, just like, you know, like, let me know and we'll let it go, but to invest three weeks of your time in having intimate conversations with him, like to me, Could it have been sped up, quote unquote, in the way of, Hey, like, you know, this sounds really great. Like, how about we go out to lunch like in the first week, right?

Lisa the Poly Wife: 42:58

It totally could have. We had, we had planned to meet. We were meeting on day two of talking, and I was leaving the next day for my road trip to Iowa. But And that and we made an, we made an appointment to see each other two days later. And that day, that morning I had COVID, I tested positive for COVID. So we ended up talking on the phone for two weeks until, and we, our date was literally day 10 of my COVID. Or day 12 of my COVID isolation, like we could not wait to be with each other. So we had just been thwarted several times, and that was why it escalated so much. And it was why, uh, I mean, really after that, I didn't date anybody for months. Because it really, it devastated me because I was completely, I didn't understand. And, and I thought it was me. What else could it be? We had been really aching to talk to, to see each other and be in person and be together. And then he couldn't look at me and, um, he told me we didn't want the same thing after exactly talking out exactly. What it was that we were looking for. So, um, uh, it was just circumstances, but it made me take the summer off. Now I've had, uh, two dates this last couple of weeks. I had a date and the guy that I had met who we had the one that I said, you know, are you in or are you out? Um, yeah, he just, his, his, it just has, I haven't heard from him and he had a death in the family. So, you know, He's busy. I'm not taking it personally. I don't care if he reaches back out. He was a really nice guy. I'd go out with him again. But, um, I'm not, I'm no longer responsible for other people's experiences of me unless they asked me for clarification and I can't give it to them. Right. It's like their opinion isn't my any of my business. the right one will come along. Now I'm talking to a guy who is, we're probably not going to date because he's doing the deep work. He's, he's doing all the emotional intelligence, all of the, um, the he's reading eight books and you know, he's his, his, his, his, Relationships have not worked. And so he's one. He wants to figure it out before he jumps into something else. And, um, so I'm like, okay, that's great. But I, I'm really excited about talking to somebody who's wanting to read these books and do the work to make themselves better, especially in a poly situation and how to do polyamory well. So I love that.

Jess the Playful Domme: 45:57

It's fantastic. Well, he might be a good ally down the road, you know, someone to connect with. Um, yeah, I mean, these are beautiful. Can you shift more from out of your mind and into your body? Even if it's for like a half hour, you know, maybe it's not like the totality of your existence, right. Giving yourself that half hour a day where. You don't have to think that you get more into your body. I know dance seems to be a common way to get people more into their bodies, but you know, what could, what would be maybe one or two things that you could do for yourself that are fun, that really do get you more into your body.

Lisa the Poly Wife: 46:45

Well, dancing for sure. Um, doing things spur of the moment without thinking about them too much ahead of time, like when. Speed Freak called me and texted and said, Hey, are you around? I'm like, come on. We've been through this. I'm not going to, I'm like, yeah, I'm just going to fuck you. I am going to do that. I will say yes. Um, so that kind of spontaneity and not being spontaneous, I think right now is the place for me to go. Um, I have stopped myself from asking a lot of these questions of this new guy that I'm talking to, even though he's exploring polyamory and wanting to, you know, talk about that. Um, I'm, I'm letting it, I'm taking, I'm letting him lead the, lead the, but I was going to talk to him and say, you know, I just want to be 100 percent clear about where you are. In chatting right now because we're not

Ella the Virgin: 47:42

in your journey

Lisa the Poly Wife: 47:44

and his journey because I want to know where the guidelines and, you know, I don't want to, I want to talk to him, and I don't want to fuck it up so I want to set sort of boundaries for our conversation, but then I wonder am I overthinking it. Right. Yeah. So it's, it's, it's a difficult thing for me, a difficult habit for me to overcome. Um, so I'm just being quiet for right now and I'll know when I know the right thing to do. Probably muscle testing would probably be a good thing or dowsing it, dowsing questions that I have. Oh, should I reach out to him? Okay. No, no, no. I can muscle test it and douse it.

Jess the Playful Domme: 48:30

I think the spontaneity thing is great for sure. And I, I, what I'm hearing and, and I could be wrong, but I'm hearing like, I got to get it right. Like, how do I get it right? Um, and there's a thing about, there's no getting, there's no getting it right. And there's no getting it wrong because at the end of the day, somehow they're both going to exist. Every time, every time we look at a situation, there's going to be something, you know,

Lisa the Poly Wife: 49:00

and both if, if instead of being right or wrong, it'll be which less, what, what am I going to, what am I going to experience joy or less, or am I going to learn something? Where's the downside to that? Right. It doesn't have to be right or wrong. It can be either. There's going to be something here to teach me to move me further along towards the right person or He's, he's the right person for right now where I am, right, I can't go back and date some of these older men that I've been with before because I've moved past where I was when I was with them, they're not ready for me, they're, they're no longer, and there may be some that I overlooked might be ready for me now. Right. But I just, I'm just going to say yes to dates and experiences. I'm not, I'm not looking for any kind of relationship because in truth, I have a nesting partner. I have a romantic partner. I have a best friend. I have a, I have as much bedmate time as I want. Really? I really want sex. So I don't have to do, I don't have, I don't have to work so hard at it.

Jess the Playful Domme: 50:12

Maybe you can, maybe you could try on just for right now, like going through like a mantra of I'm open to joyful sex.

Ella the Virgin: 50:21

That's it.

Lisa the Poly Wife: 50:21

That's a great idea.

Jess the Playful Domme: 50:22

Yeah. I'm open to epic sex. Yeah. Not even okay sex. I'm open to epic sex. I'm available for epic sex. I'm available for epic sex. Okay. I'm available for epic sex.

Lisa the Poly Wife: 50:34

Okay. I love that. Absolutely.

Jess the Playful Domme: 50:37

That's what I'm available for right now. And relationship, whatever status, I don't, that's not on the best. That's five steps down the road right now. Step one. I'm, I'm available for epic sex.

Ella the Virgin: 50:49

Yeah, that's great.

Lisa the Poly Wife: 50:52

Okay, the T shirt.

Jess the Playful Domme: 50:53

So, and Ella. Yeah. Great. Go check, check out the website. Ella, tell us what's enough, a little. Tip of an update about your Tantra chair. Oh, it finally arrived. Um, I don't even know what day it is. The day before yesterday it arrived. Um, so

Ella the Virgin: 51:14

there's this big thing, there's this big rainstorm. We haven't had rain in a while. And, uh, so the guys who are delivering is like, your chair's here. So somehow everybody knows this chair's arriving. So, um, got it pulled in and, uh, set up in my room. Uh, so just waiting for my partner to show up on Thursday. He's been Check it in. Hey, is it there yet? Is it there yet? So I have more to report. Um, starting all next week when we, when we talk on the podcast, but lovely, beautiful piece of artwork. The chair is amazing. It's a little bit longer than I expected. It's like six feet. I want to say five and a half, six feet. Um, it's stunning. So anyway, fantastic. So, um, looking forward to, uh, trying it out and I hope to see you next week or the following week. Um, we're going to have Over to Hawaii. So I'd love to see you for some coaching as well.

Jess the Playful Domme: 52:05

Yeah. Yeah. I'm so, so delighted.

Ella the Virgin: 52:08

Couple coaching. Yeah, I know, right? Couple coaching.

Jess the Playful Domme: 52:12

Yeah, just it, I think that that it does create a space for allowing, again, like also a level of, of safety to be vulnerable too. Because I think that, um, sometimes it. It's hard for us to be very, to be vulnerable with our partners, um, alone and uh, and having someone be a, a space holder and a guide to support.

Ella the Virgin: 52:38

Oh, with you? Oh yeah. We can hardly wait. Yeah. Cause again, we don't even know what we don't even know because again, we're really, although I would say our loving is, is very, very, very, very good. Um, good plus as we joke, um, but it's, again, it becomes. routine. And so again, we don't know what we don't know. And so I think I'm excited, super excited. And I obviously I trust you wholeheartedly. So show us, you know, show us what we're, what we're ready for, I guess is what I would say. So I'm looking forward to it.

Jess the Playful Domme: 53:08

Yeah, I super appreciate, um, uh, super appreciate the opportunity. Um, yeah. And being here for me, just a really quick update for our listeners. Um, I'm here on Maui to, uh, receive some holistic treatments for my HPV that I found out I had a year ago. And, um, And as is apropos for for me and my, my journeys of things don't always go as clear cut as I thought they would go. And so when I arrived here last week at my first appointment with my doctor and she went in to go see my cervix, and she needs to access the cervix to do the treatment. And my cervix had pulled so far back and to the left, the ligaments pulled so far to the left that she couldn't access the face of my cervix. Um, and so the last, yeah, the last, um, which I guess it, it is common to have the cervix kind of pulled to the left or to the right, but mine is pretty, um, Um, so very strongly pulled to the left. And so the last four days have been, um, you know, researching, making phone calls, trying to find either a mind abdominal massage therapist or a pelvic rehabilitation specialist. Um, finally finding a chiropractor who does Webster technique, which is, um, a technique that they do on pregnant women to help alleviate the sacrum and lots of things that we fully understand. Um, But I was really surprised that there, so far I am not able to find women who do internal womb work, um, and could help, you know, realign things. And so I found that really, um, fascinating. So It's kind of like the, the, I was, I was getting actually very distraught, um, not very, I was getting distraught that like, you know, I'm here for a certain amount of time. Um, like this is the treatments need to happen and so just kind of like maneuvering through all those things and in my body so it's. It's been, um, a really interesting experience. And then while I'm here, it's like, I'm working out at the gym with a trainer who I used two years ago. I'm doing colonics like I did before I'm doing ozone therapy treatment. So it's like a really kind of like deep dive in body care. Um, while also trying to find, um, practitioners that can help me align my, realign my cervix. So, um, interestingly, I did not know that the cervix is actually like an internal penis Inside a woman's body, the shape of it, I had no idea. So there's like actually like a neck and there's a head to it. Mm-Hmm. Um, and so I'm just kind of like, you know, yeah. I'm like, wow, I've been the cock whisper and now I get to be my own inner cock whisper. Like, you know, how do I, how do I seduce my, my inner cock to like move and, you know, stuff like that. And, um, it's, it's very, it's actually fascinating'cause if you squat, if you squat down. and put your hand inside, you can feel your, your cervix. And for me, I have to like squat down and actually kind of like grunt, like kind of do like a squeezing motion. And then I can feel part of it, but I can't feel the head of it. It's like so far to the left. So it's pretty, it's a pretty fascinating, um, a journey right now and uh, I'm just so grateful for the kindness of people that I'm calling and I, um, a lot of them, they're not able to, to help me for whatever reason, but they're giving me some tidbits and then, you know, suggesting another contact. So it's, um, so I'm, I'm very, very thankful for that. Very thankful for their, their graciousness. Um, so yeah. Today I get to try again. And yesterday I saw the chiropractor. So, um, fingers crossed that we can access what we need to, but it's really kind of shedding a light from shining a light for me on, um, internal wound work and, uh, what is out there to do that. And what can I learn to become someone that can hopefully provide that for others.

Lisa the Poly Wife: 57:32

Well, I'm, I'm glad you are.

Jess the Playful Domme: 57:34

That is my update.

Lisa the Poly Wife: 57:36

I am glad you're finding help. My, I've been seeing a pelvic floor physical therapist and her specialty is cervix and, um, pregnant women specifically. Cause it helps women. She helps women get pregnant because their cervix, I think is not in the right place. So I know exactly what you're talking about, but she's having a baby. I think she had a baby this week. Um, and but she'll be around when you get back. If you still for some reason need to speak or see somebody, maybe, um,

Jess the Playful Domme: 58:08

is she does she do internal work.

Lisa the Poly Wife: 58:10

Yeah, all the work she's been doing on me has been internal.

Jess the Playful Domme: 58:14

Okay,

Lisa the Poly Wife: 58:14

try to find out what my problem is my problem is I have. I'm having, um, painful sex and it's the actual entry of my vagina. The, those muscles have been pulled tight and her working those muscles on internally on me has released my hip. So that hip flex, pull. Was all, all of my insights were locked up and twisted the work that she's been doing. Now I can walk. I can, I'm pretty sure I could run for at least a short distance. Um, so I'm getting stronger and stronger. So she's specifically an internal, um, um, pelvic area, female gynecological, uh, physical therapist.

Ella the Virgin: 59:03

Wow.

Jess the Playful Domme: 59:03

Awesome.

Lisa the Poly Wife: 59:04

Yeah. So

Jess the Playful Domme: 59:06

yeah, that's exactly what I'm looking for is someone who can do internal work.

Lisa the Poly Wife: 59:11

Yep. That's

Jess the Playful Domme: 59:11

awesome.

Lisa the Poly Wife: 59:12

I hope that you can find it there.

Jess the Playful Domme: 59:13

Wow. Yeah. Thank you. Yeah. Open for miracles for sure. Definitely. Um, well, any final thoughts as we wrap up our podcast today, Ella?

Ella the Virgin: 59:26

Nope, looking forward to seeing you next week. So hurry up, get better.

Jess the Playful Domme: 59:33

Thank you. Noted. Lisa, any thoughts for you?

Lisa the Poly Wife: 59:36

Nope. I'm good. I'm complete.

Jess the Playful Domme: 59:39

Yeah. Awesome. Well, thank you all so much for listening to our latest podcast and share with us your thoughts. And, um, you know, we, we love having a, a communal pot, so to speak, of our resources and, um, insights and awarenesses and experiences. You know, we're all into this, um, beautiful journey together in deepening and expanding our growth and capacity of love and understanding and connection with one another. So thank you all so much for now. Bye everyone. Want more? Head over to the playfulpodcast. com for all the juicy things we have to offer. From there you can join our community where you can get access to after hours, attend upcoming workshops and events, and even book a session. Bye for now.